Saipan:Caves

[joe_oppenheimer]

but no where does it state either on Guadalcanal or Saipan that they get fire-first, so it's not an errata.

I always thought the following line in the Guadalcanal special rules meant caves got all the same benefits as entrenchments (including First Fire):

Units in a cave are treated as if in an entrenchment, and benefit from an additional -1 column shift when fired on by direct fire.

[campsawyer]

Treat them like entrenchments as units can be both in and out of them in the same hex and that they can use different combat modifier for that situation but no where does it state either on Guadalcanal or Saipan that they get fire-first, so it's not an errata.

Jay, I must respectfully dispute the fact that this is errata to all the rules. One of the rules of technical writing is if you specify that something is the same as something else, it inherits all characteristic of the other item, except what you specify. So if one says that caves are the same as entrenchments, then they will inherit all the characteristics, first fire, unless specified.

[joe_oppenheimer]

Jay - I think it is fine if you want to rule that Caves in Saipan should not get first fire; if you playtested them that way then that should be the rule.

But without errata or a special rule, the rules as written say to treat caves as entrenchments and that would give them first fire.

[JayTownsend]

I sent AP an email about it this weekend to confirm. But I will play it the way I had intended it to be played.

[joe_oppenheimer]

But I will play it the way I had intended it to be played.

Designers intent is always my first question with regard to rules. I have no problem with your saying that Caves do not allow First Fire in Saipan. If that is how you playtested it than that is how we should play it.

[I just disagree that "Units in a cave are treated as if in an entrenchment" can be interpreted to mean that they don't get First Fire]

[campsawyer]

Updated. Just 3 stack question to resolve.

Ok, I believe that I have wrapped my mind around the assault with units inside and out. Here are some thoughts with regard to assaults:

- Units inside caves do not get First Fire on the attackers.

- The attacker assault gets a -2 column shift for units that are inside the cave only. This means a split column assault resolution similar to direct fire.

- Side with worst losses must leave cave hex, this includes units in an out of the cave. Other side gets Free Shot.