Avalanche Press Games That Are Not PG

[awdougherty]

I own a number of Second World War at Sea games (Midway, Bomb Alley, Coral Sea, Arctic Convoy, and Bismarck) and because of the Labor Day sale, I just ordered Alamein. I will never have time to play the latter, and while I've had the former set up and ready to, I never managed to pull the trigger.

Both games look really solid, however. I know AP sometimes has a bad rep amongst gamers, but I was wondering if anyone here had sampled other AP wares? I'm really excited to get SWWAS to the table and even though I thought the rules could really use a rewrite, the game series as a whole looks great.

Anyone else have good luck with other AP titles?

[Shad]

Red Steel (BGG link) - which I'm pretty sure is OOP and can be had for less than $20 new - is a very solid wargame.

I also own Bitter Victory: The Invasion of Sicily, 1943 (BGG link) but was put off by the bone-headed errata. Those who've sucked it up and pushed on do report that it is a nice game. Also quite cheap.

[Matt W]

Note that Red Steel uses the same game system as Alamein. I too, found Red Steel to be a solid game about a topic rarely touched on. I have games in both of the naval series Great War at Sea and Second World War at Sea and have found them to be highly enjoyable and, like PG, at a level of abstraction which permits a good gaming experience without requiring the equivalent of a law degree to work through the rules.

[beast013]

Red Steel is good. Red God of War was also good. For the SWWAS series, I have found them to be very well done. They are quick plays compared to other WWII tactical naval games (Command at Sea) but still hold good mechanics as well as accuracy. Coral Sea has a low counter density and can be played in three hours, thus a good starting point. APL site also offers lots of add-ons and file/playing aids to help play the game/series.

[awdougherty]

I was trying to get Coral Sea to the table and some confusion on my part about something really silly made me and my gaming buddy switch to something else until I could get my question resolved. Unfortunately we never got it back to the table. I need to give it a go. Can it be solo'ed?

What's the rulebook look like for Alamein/Red Steel? A long slog or not too bad?

I personally believe that PG is one of the best balances between simplicity and complexity I've seen in my wargaming experience, SWWAS seems like it has that same potential (although it needs it's equivalent of the PG 3.0 rules rewrite that makes it all finally click).

[rerathbun]

I, too have SWWAS and Red Steel/Alamein. Rules for Red Steel are not bad at all. Haven't read Alamein, but I do know it includes more rules for supply and air than Red Steel does.

SWWAS can be soloed (there are rules for solo play HERE). I would suggest trying one of the convoy scenarios from Bomb Alley rather than the CV vs CV battle in Coral Sea for solo play. For me, the CV battles really shine with a live opponent. Avalanche Press has a free VASSAL module for Coral Sea HERE if you want to try it but don't have anyone to play ftf.

[Shad]

Years ago I asked and was told that the planned Red Desert was based on the Alamein rules as well...

[J6A]

I have They Shall Not Pass along with a lot of GWaS and SWWaS and want to get it to the table soon.

[campsawyer]

I have the SWWAS and GWAS series. Both are good but have some issues with the rules. These have been cleaned up and revised in some of the supplements as we as Jim Stear working on the rules currently. I find them a bit tougher to solo because most naval battles require more of an unknown factor of what your enemy is doing. The solo rules help, but I found them easy for larger forces to dominate the smaller forces. Playing the Bismark campaign is not as fun as you can contain it quickly even with the solo rules. But the series is probably the most complete of nations OoB for there navies from 1900-1945.

As for other games the Great Battles series is very interesting. Much like PG in simplicity, but alot of nuances that make the game interesting. Good solo structure too. The only downside is the simple combat, in play plays it tends to rack up the casualties very quickly. With the latest rules set, recovery makes this a little less devastating.

[zovs]

The only other AP games I have are Defiant Russia and Red Vengeance. Both are pretty good strategic games IIRC (Have not played them in years).