3rd vs 4th edition

[Greyfox]

I agree that there are a number of improvements; however, on thing that has not been adressed. There are no direct or anti-tank penalties for someone moving accross a bridge or ford; through a wadi or a mountain defile; nor along a sunken track or riverbed. The fact that there is not a choke point die role modifier for those able to fire along a constricted avenue of approach is surprising. Don't know about you, but that is exactly the type of terraim I like to lay in my ambushes or establish my battle positions. Imagine how that could change the dynamics of a scenario like "Bicycle Races" in White Eagles or increase the effectiveness of mountain troops in alpine or rough terrain.

[J6A]

Not to mention the firing modifier for when visibility is 1 or 2 hexes at night.

[Matt W]

Greyfox,

You can still get some of that effect by setting up flanking shots to take during movement. If you use hidden counters this can be a particularly deadly approach.

[Greyfox]

Greyfox,

You can still get some of that effect by setting up flanking shots to take during movement.  If you use hidden counters this can be a particularly deadly approach.

While I agree that the rules allow you to do so it is an imperfect substitute at best.  As an Infantry officer, I always look for canalizing terrain in order to lay in my defense.  If I can develop an engagement area, pre-plot fires, and lay in obstacles within weapons effects range of canalizing terrain, I do so.

[Hugmenot]

Just mod it and see if you like the results.

Add a +1 modifier or whatever you feel appropriate if you believe a prepared defense in a channeling terrain should be more effective.

"Crossing a bridge" is not defined under the current rules but you could always say on which side of the river a unit is when it enters a hex containing a bridge. You might also need mods to determine on which side of the river (or on the bridge proper) is a unit that was demoralized while crossing the bridge; it may matter if they are on the far side and need to flee across the bridge and suffer the penalty again.

I am not trying to discourage you, i am all for people adding rules they like to make the games better for them, but it's not a simple task.

Please let us know what worked and what did not work if you mod it!

[Matt W]

Also, some people have used modifiers for masked AT fire permitting, IIRC, an AT gun to be efficient (fire twice in a turn) and "hidden" unable to be spotted unless adjacent for its first fire of a scenario. I could see doing something similar with any prepared position. If nothing else it would demand a certain amount of caution on the part of the maneuvering force.

[Greyfox]

Also, some people have used modifiers for masked AT fire permitting, IIRC, an AT gun to be efficient (fire twice in a turn) and "hidden" unable to be spotted unless adjacent for its first fire of a scenario.  I could see doing something similar with any prepared position.  If nothing else it would demand a certain amount of caution on the part of the maneuvering force.

       Will try out what you recommended and report back in as soon as able.  I am in the process of PCSing (Primary Change of Station - i.e. moving) to a new duty station stateside.  My last job prevented me from playing anything at all.  I have been nothing but busy since Mr. Putin invaded Crimea.  I was the first lead planner for Atlantic Resolve, and was subsequently the Plans Branch Chief for US Army Europe (USAREUR). My next job, an XO for the Professor of Military Science at Virginia Tech, will be closer to a 9 to 5 (not counting Physical Training, which should allow some gaming time again. 
       I may replay "Bicycle races" from White Eagles or some similar river crossing scenario, and will report results. Only one question -  IIRC?  I never saw that acronym before.

[Greyfox]

Just mod it and see if you like the results.

Add a +1 modifier or whatever you feel appropriate if you believe a prepared defense in a channeling terrain should be more effective.

"Crossing a bridge" is not defined under the current rules but you could always say on which side of the river a unit  is when it enters a hex containing a  bridge.  You might also need mods to determine on which side of the river (or on the bridge proper) is a unit that was demoralized while crossing the bridge; it may matter if they are on the far side and need to flee across the bridge and suffer the penalty again.

I am not trying to discourage you, i am all for people adding rules they like to make the games better for them, but it's not a simple task.

Please let us know what worked and what did not work if you mod it!

I remembered that I sent an e-mail about this subject to Doug McNair at avalanche press years ago.  Found it within a couple of minutes. What I pulled from the e-mail is very rough and focused on attacking out of the bridge hex, but might work.  Doug recommended that I write up for daily content; nine years later it still hasn't been done.  On 27 April 2008, I sent Doug this and one other recommendation:

If attacking from a Bridge hex to assault units in adjacent Hexes there should be a negative column shift to the attacker.  Basically you are attacking across a narrow front along an avenue of approach that is both restrictive and is subject to being raked by direct fire.  Could be a special rule that applies to only scenarios where attackers are trying
to secure bridges.  Say a negative one or two column shift to the attacker, and/or first fire to a defender when defending against an attacker assaulting from a bridge hex.

Like I said more focused on the attacker; with a negative column modifier for attacking out of a bridge hex, than to the defender.  Thoughts.

[rerathbun]

Only one question -  IIRC?  I never saw that acronym before.

IIRC = if I recall correctly

[Hugmenot]

"If attacking from a Bridge hex to assault units in adjacent Hexes there should be a negative column shift to the attacker".

It makes sense to me if the attacking units start on the far bank and have to cross the bridge but less sense if they are already on the same bank as the units they will be attacking. Not sure if they are on the bridge or even if "on the bridge should be location in game terms. Keep in mind penalizing them twice (+1 when fired upon with opportunity fire, +1 for defenders in assault) may make it too difficult for the attackers.

Best testing ground may be Beyond Normandy because bridges are between hexes. May be worth a try there to assess basic modifiers before resolving the in-hex bridge ambiguities.