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+--- Thread: [Rules] 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me (/showthread.php?tid=748)
RE: 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me - campsawyer - 02-26-2014
(02-26-2014, 11:14 PM)Memenne Wrote: "You also can not activate 3 x modules of OBA at once and have them all fire at different hexes. Any OBA activated in the same activation segment (AS) must be used at the same hex."
Vince,
I don't see that in the rules. Does it come from an errata ?
9.3 Up to three offboard bombardment fire values may combine into one fire value, but may not combine with on-map units.
RE: 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me - vince hughes - 02-27-2014
(02-26-2014, 11:14 PM)Memenne Wrote: Vince,
I don't see that in the rules. Does it come from an errata ?
I really had a strong feeling somebody might ask that
Two references for this:
7.33 (para 3) - COMBINING FIRE: Up to three offboard artillery factors may be combined into ONE attack per action segment.
9.3 COMBINED FIRE (para 2): Up to three offboard bombardment fire values may combine into ONE fire value but may not combine with on-map units.
RE: 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me - Memenne - 02-27-2014
Well, for me, the sentence does not say that you have only one attack allowed, ie one attack on one hex.
It says you can have maximum 3 OBA factors combined in one attack.
And so, you could fire each factor on a different hex.
My interpretation is also based on the example of 9.3 :
Example: The scenario instructions give the American player an off-map artillery value of "3 x 20." These may be combined into one 60-value bombardment, one of 40 and one of 20, or three separate bombardments of 20. They may not be combined with any onboard units.
I suppose it's a subtlety of language I don't perceive. This is where my english shows his limits...
RE: 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me - plloyd1010 - 02-27-2014
You may have found a technical hole in the rules. It is strongly implied, but specifically stated, that the off-board artillery factors may attack only one hex in a given activation. I checked rules 3.14, 7.33, & 9.4. We've always played with one artillery strike constituting the activation, not up to 3 off-board artillery activating and attacking different hexes.
RE: 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me - thomaso827 - 02-27-2014
The idea of one attack to me points out the idea of one target hex. I do recall the exception to single hex attacks being HMGs.
"7.23 Split Fire.
A unit must apply its entire fire value against a single target - it may not “split” its fire to attack more than one target in the same action segment. EXCEPTION: An HMG unit may divide its direct fire value to attack multiple targets in the same action segment."
If each OBA element is a unit, then they would fall within this. So, like combining other units, when combined, they may only fire at one target hex.
RE: 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me - campsawyer - 02-27-2014
Quote:And so, you could fire each factor on a different hex.
Interesting.
If the idea of on board artillery with BF capability stacked together, activates, it can have each unit fire at a different or the same hex in multiple attacks. Does this extend to OBA?
RE: 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me - Memenne - 02-27-2014
In my opinion, yes.
But I think I am the only one thinking this way :-D
RE: 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me - thomaso827 - 02-27-2014
Maybe I'm misinterpreting things. I understood that a stack activates as a stack and fires at a single target hex. But now I see the word "may" in there. That sort of weakens the argument. In the few solo games I have played so far, I either activate a stack to fire on a single target, or I activate individual units in a hex over several activations with different targets, or to fire on the same target multiple times, even though those shots will be resolved at lower firepower.
In that understanding, OBA activated together combines fire on one target hex, or fires separately over several activations, to fire on different hexes or to fire multiple smaller FP missions on the same hex.
RE: 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me - plloyd1010 - 02-27-2014
The maxim is if there is not prohibition, there is allowance. Corollaries to the maxim would be things like specified procedure rules (ie: You do "it" this way, thereby preventing use of another method.) Thus since there is no rule actually saying you cannot activate all your off-board artillery, you can. Since there is no rule actually saying all activated off-board artillery factors must be directed against a single hex, they needn't be. All that seems to be specified is, no more than 3 off-board artillery factors may be combined, individual factors may not be split, activating off-board artillery is a normal activation, and (functionally) nothing else may activate when they do.
As I said, technical hole.
RE: 8.4 Elevation makes no sense to me - campsawyer - 02-27-2014
(02-27-2014, 03:54 AM)thomaso827 Wrote: Maybe I'm misinterpreting things. I understood that a stack activates as a stack and fires at a single target hex. But now I see the word "may" in there. That sort of weakens the argument. In the few solo games I have played so far, I either activate a stack to fire on a single target, or I activate individual units in a hex over several activations with different targets, or to fire on the same target multiple times, even though those shots will be resolved at lower firepower.
In that understanding, OBA activated together combines fire on one target hex, or fires separately over several activations, to fire on different hexes or to fire multiple smaller FP missions on the same hex.
When you activate the stack to "FIRE", you are doing just that activating. The act of firing is separate and can be individual or combine if all the requirements are met.