[Rules] FitS Scenario 4 set-up

[J6A]

The set up for this scenario says the Russians have to set up at least 9 hexes from the west edge.  If I count the half-hexes as hex #1, that will put them in the 0500 row of the map in question.  However, the set up also requires the Russians to specifically set up units in hexes 0409 and 0410.  Again, counting the half-hexes, that's 10 rows from the west edge.

My gut feeling is that the 0409/0410 row is supposed to be the forward limit for set-up and the required set-up there forces the Russians to put troops on the front line, not to give them a hex of cushion in front of that.  And I'm not sure.

Has anyone played this scenario and encountered this issue?  What was your solution?

[plloyd1010]

Half hexes do count, so the western most setup would be hexes 05xx. The 0409/0410 will force a setup in the town. How much you may or may not support that position, but that is another question.

[J6A]

Half hexes do count, so the western most setup would be hexes 05xx. The 0409/0410 will force a setup in the town. How much you may or may not support that position, but that is another question.

Okay..it just struck me as odd that it wouldn't force the Russians into the 05xx town hexes.  And good enough.

[patman]

Wait Wait WAIT! Half hexes do count *as being hexes*, but they are surely hex 0, not hex 1, because THEY CONTAIN THE EDGE!!! "One hex away from the edge" is the hex ADJACENT to the half-hex containing the edge, NOT THE HALF-HEX CONTAINING THE EDGE!!! In other words, J6A's gut feeling is correct, it *IS* the 04 row that is meant to be the forward limit in that scenario in question. 

Also note that whole hexes do not have this issue, since they are next to the edge and do not contain it.

This just came up for me because I am playing Scenario 5 in Pusan Perimeter with exactly this kind of "boundary condition." It was clear to me from the situation that counting half-hexes as hex 0 and not hex 1 was the right thing to do.

Pat

[plloyd1010]

Rule 2.2, Game Boards

[patman]

Yeah Peter, it says "Half-hexes on the board edges may be used (they are "playable")". This is true, but they are STILL ON THE EDGE!

You are conflating two different things, playability and being ON the edge. Doesn't change an iota of what I wrote. If you are "one hex from the edge", you are not in the hex that contains the edge.

EDIT:

You know, I should probably just concede that you are right here and say that the rule pushes the edge to the top or far side of the half hex. So yes, I concede. But what I think is happening is that sometimes the scenario designers view things my way, and sometimes (perhaps most of the time) yours. I think J6A discovered a case of the former.

[J6A]

EDIT:

You know, I should probably just concede that you are right here and say that the rule pushes the edge to the top or far side of the half hex. So yes, I concede. But what I think is happening is that sometimes the scenario designers view things my way, and sometimes (perhaps most of the time) yours. I think J6A discovered a case of the former.

That is my suspicion, that the scenario designer didn't count the half hex in the set up instructions.  And we're playing it as written.  The Soviets in the town are pretty much doomed anyway.  I don't expect it to affect the ultimate outcome.

[plloyd1010]

That is my suspicion, that the scenario designer didn't count the half hex in the set up instructions.  And we're playing it as written.  The Soviets in the town are pretty much doomed anyway.  I don't expect it to affect the ultimate outcome.

I'm not so sure. On the mechanical side, playable but not counted is rather sketchy logic to me. Also the German setup instructions place them just opposite the Russians. Gamewise, the requirement that units be placed in 3-0409 and 3-0410 forces the Soviets to either fight over the town or (considering the likely initiative outcome) attempt a retreat under fire or abandon 2 units to destruction.

Considering that the Soviets are functionally outflanked, I expect their best options are to fight for the broad 3 town and interdict the forest road.