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Where to start?
#11
Of course you can download 4th edition rules for free and buy a cheaper used PG Afrika Korps and have 50 scenarios with lots of Australian troops.

All editions of the rules worked
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#12
Thanks for all the good advice guys,

Im leaning towards Elsenborn Ridge as it seems to have a good range of units and it has been well played (so I assume any mistakes would have been picked up and fixed), Though my eyes are looking towards Liberation 44 to as I would imagine the battles the Brits had with the Germans in normandy would make for some very good scenarios.

I don't know what it is but I feel An army at dawn would make a good purchase if I discover I enjoy PG (after my first purchase), I seem to have had this trend when buying war games, I don't normally start with games set in North Africa (I don't know why, but just something I have always done)

Western Europe seems to be my testing grounds (which is probably shading my decision) then I head East and into the desert.
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#13
What are people's options of beyond Normandy and desert rats I have found a copy or each brand new in Australia. Or am I better going with the new 4th edition games?
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#14
Both are interesting games, I feel the scenarios are more ragged from a balance perspective. There is no reason you couldn't use 4th Ed Rules and charts in either game.

Desert Rats has 2 maps of rather simplistic terrain. All hexes are clear unless otherwise noted in the scenario special rules. The most frequent modification is creating hills.. If you are into experimentation, you should get it. I found the British armor to be less interesting than Afrika Korps. Otherwise I think I was pretty good.

Beyond Normandy was sort of a beauty pageant in mu-mus. The game introduces some interesting concepts. It is the 2nd game in which SS troops appear. The scenarios reflect the attritional approach to warfare the British are employing. There are 2 problems that may give you pause. The maps are very different from the system. A strange mix of comic and ugly. The British Firefly tanks are underrated, though the system will overrate them for this time period when Lib'44 is introduced. If you can get it cheap get it for the counters & scenarios, otherwise wait for Lib'44.
... actually you Americans are probably the most dangerous people in the world. This is because you treat war as a job, and your culture has an excellent work ethic.
-- paraphrased from John Keegan's Fields of Battle

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#15
Whatever you can purchase cheaply locally I'd go for.  Beyond Normandy , like Africa Korps Guadalcanal, Desert Rats, and Casino, uses paper maps, a practice PG has abandoned, but has lots of good gaming.  It includes an extra layer of formation activation rules that was only tried once, but the play is the thing. :-).

In the mean time, there is plenty of support for all these games in the form of AAR's and discussion threads here :-)
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#16
Thanks for your help guys.

I have done a lot of searching around and seems I have come across 3 titles (from the newer games) that i can get for an alright price from the states with shipping. They are:

Elsenborn Ridge (with 3rd ed rules) is there any other difference from the newest edition components wise?

Liberation 44 (4th Ed) anyone have any experience with this one, a good spread of scenarios?

Army at Dawn (4th Ed)

If i can get a good rate on combined shipping I might even get 2 of them.
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#17
The components in ER didn't change. I think it comes from APL with 4th Ed rules & charts now.

If you are thinking about ordering multiple games, you might consider joining the Gold Club. Do the math before you do that. The break even point is $135-150 U.S. Ordering 2 games might be of value, 3 definitely would be. If you do join the Gold Club, don't forget to pick-up and download the freebies.
... actually you Americans are probably the most dangerous people in the world. This is because you treat war as a job, and your culture has an excellent work ethic.
-- paraphrased from John Keegan's Fields of Battle

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#18
Keep in mind out new friend is an Aussie shipping will be a bear, even with Gold Club status.
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#19
Shipping should not be the issue here, apart from minimum shipments should result in minimum price. Any basic formula is 35/0.2=175. factor in a couple freebies, now decide if the $35 is a net positive. If you not going to order at least $150 in games before the end of the year, I wouldn't do it. If I was, I would get the Gold Club and wait for the email with the coupon codes.
... actually you Americans are probably the most dangerous people in the world. This is because you treat war as a job, and your culture has an excellent work ethic.
-- paraphrased from John Keegan's Fields of Battle

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#20
Well shipping on 1 game say Elsenborn ridge, is going to cost me $42 US from AP would the membership give discounts on shipping and purchases?
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